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Guyr Adamantine
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Post by Guyr Adamantine »

Prak_Anima wrote:So Barnes and Nobles is doing their annual holiday book drive for needy kids. And of course the male 10-15 group usually gets a bit shafted in these kinds of things, and for some reason I figure the nerd male 10-15 group even more so.

So I want to give nerdy book or two that the kids might enjoy and am thinking of something from the Discworld series, but I'm not sure what.

Apparently one of the books that came to mind from reputation, Wee Free Men, is actually a young adult novel, so it might be good, but I was also thinking of the few I've read: Monstrous Regiment, Guards Guards, and Carpe Jugulum.

I'm thinking of those three that Guards Guards would probably be the safest bet, but can anyone suggest anything else that'd be good for young under privledged nerdlings?
I suggest Guards Guards, Mort and Reaper Man. I really like the Death series. :tongue:
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Maxus
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Post by Maxus »

Wee Free Men is *amazingly* good.

Also, checked out an author named Ursula Vernon. She has two books out--one named Nurk, another named Dragonbreath.
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.

--The horror of Mario

Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
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Prak
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Post by Prak »

thanks for the suggestions.

I've been seeing books from the "Dante Valentine" Series at B&N too, anyone know if it's any good? Or indeed, able to tell me what the hell they're about?
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Post by Mask_De_H »

I enjoyed the hell out of the Fifth Elephant.

I recently finished two books: Fool by Christopher Moore, and The Blade Itself by Joe Abercrombie. Both pretty solid: Fool is a humorous retelling of King Lear from the Fool's point of view, while The Blade Itself is a vaguely gritty modern sword and sorcery story. Multiple POVs, little magic, lots of swearing, the works. Reads like a dream though, the prose is strong and confident.
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Post by Parthenon »

I just finished Anathem by Neal Stephenson. Like a lot of books I found it difficult to get into at first but I tried what I sometimes do: start reading about a third of the way in and see if its at all interesting. I found that once it started talking about quantum mechanics and philosophy it got really good so I went back to the beginning and read it all.

Just wondering, does anyone else do that when they can't get into a book?

However, just about straight after I finished reading I suddenly got really confused because the whole plot contradicts itself and makes no fucking sense whatsoever in terms of the theories described.
A lot of it is about Complex Protism, which to my simplistic view seems to be a mix of the Plato Forms and multiple world theories. So, there is a one directional transfer of information between worlds. I'm simplifying it down to the train model Neal uses below.

[Platonic ideal world (Called the HTW in Anathem)] -> ... -> [Arbre (world of Anathem)] -> [Tor] -> [Laterre (Earth)] -> [Forgotten the name at the moment] -> [Urdan] -> ...

So, we can perceive ideas in the Platonic ideal world and so create theories or prove theorems and so on. And what we do affects other worlds in some way.

BUT

The whole plot is that somehow scientists in Arbre managed to send visions to Urdan of a great catastrophe. Then, because the people in Urdan thought that the visions were from the past they decided to travel faster than light and go back in time to stop the catastrophe. To stop paradoxes they got shifted to another universe closer to the Platonic Ideal World, and then they shifted again, and again, and again.

So, one the one hand information can only go in one direction between the worlds. But, the Urdans travel in the opposite direction between the worlds. This is impossible by the theory Neal spends much of the book describing.
Am I missing the point or does the plot actively contradict his own explanation of whats going on?


@ Prak_Anima
I've just finished reading Night Shift by Lilith Saintcrow. Mostly because I hate myself I admit: I have this weird fascination with Mary-Sue modern day/near future fantasy where the heroine has magic powers/is the best in the world at exorcism/killing vampires/being a badass. You know, Anita Blake, Sookie Stackhouse, that sort of bullshit.

And Night Shift wasn't bad, I guess. For a Stockholm Syndrome suffering, fucked up, woe is me, deal with the devil, weirdly attractive to supernatural males, gutter to... further from the gutter heroine.

Seriously. The main character has this weird history where she used to be a prostitute but was brought off the street by a sociopathic man whose whole existence is killing, and then was systematically abused physically and mentally. She is brainwashed into believing that it is normal, even needed, that she both loves and hates her abuser and that it is normal for a teacher-student relationship to include sex. She then regularly deals with her fucked up life by getting drunk and having random sex.

If the writer was a man I'd accuse it of being misogynistic bullshit.

But maybe the earlier books she's written are better.
Last edited by Parthenon on Thu Dec 17, 2009 6:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by Cynic »

Prak: Comic book series like Bone and Salt Water Taffy among others are very good.
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Post by Crissa »

Writing can be misogynistic and written by a woman.

Ann Coulter, for instance. Twilight, for instance. I could go on and on...

Although, it depends on whether the book treats it as normal or the story does. A Handmaiden's Tale includes alot of misogyny, without being misogynistic.

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Post by Prak »

Parthenon wrote:@ Prak_Anima
I've just finished reading Night Shift by Lilith Saintcrow. Mostly because I hate myself I admit: I have this weird fascination with Mary-Sue modern day/near future fantasy where the heroine has magic powers/is the best in the world at exorcism/killing vampires/being a badass. You know, Anita Blake, Sookie Stackhouse, that sort of bullshit.

And Night Shift wasn't bad, I guess. For a Stockholm Syndrome suffering, fucked up, woe is me, deal with the devil, weirdly attractive to supernatural males, gutter to... further from the gutter heroine.

Seriously. The main character has this weird history where she used to be a prostitute but was brought off the street by a sociopathic man whose whole existence is killing, and then was systematically abused physically and mentally. She is brainwashed into believing that it is normal, even needed, that she both loves and hates her abuser and that it is normal for a teacher-student relationship to include sex. She then regularly deals with her fucked up life by getting drunk and having random sex.

If the writer was a man I'd accuse it of being misogynistic bullshit.

But maybe the earlier books she's written are better.
ugh. well, maybe I'll give one a shot... I mean, hell, I enjoyed the first Anita Blake book, even though she's one of the less interesting characters...
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Post by RiotGearEpsilon »

Anathem was pretty good stuff. Stephenson figured out a way to make his endings work, I think.

Recently I've been chewing everything by Stross up. Singularity Sky, Iron Sunrise, Accelerando, and currently I'm reading Glasshouse.
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Post by Cynic »

Riot -- it's been a while since i saw you around so hello.

But 'Anathem' kinda reminded me in writing style to stephenson's early work such as 'Snow crash' and 'The Diamond age.'

Not as serious as cryptonomicon or the Baroque cycle.
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Post by Crissa »

Those are some of the fav novels at my spouse's workplace.

Also, Hikaru no Go.

For some reason, the original-language books cost through the roof.

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Post by RiotGearEpsilon »

Cynic wrote:Riot -- it's been a while since i saw you around so hello.

But 'Anathem' kinda reminded me in writing style to stephenson's early work such as 'Snow crash' and 'The Diamond age.'

Not as serious as cryptonomicon or the Baroque cycle.
Yar, muchas gracias.

It does feel kinda Snow Crashy. It has a better ending than either of them while simultaneously avoiding the 'neatly wrapped up' syndrome that he works so hard to avoid, so I was very pleased with it.
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Post by Maxus »

Okay, I was thinking about the Harry Potter series today and wondering WHY it's so successful.

It's...easy to dismiss it as a kid's series, but it grew up along with its first readers. I mean, the first book presents the magical side of things as happy and funny and with a lot of stuff played for laughs.

Then each book after becomes increasingly darker. The second book has a basilisk which can kill people by making direct eye contact. The only reason they DON'T lose several characters is blind luck which means people keep on seeing it through reflections and the like.

Then soul-eating monsters and finding out a minor feature had been a potentially lethal threat.

Then the fourth book, you've got patricide and murder, and some creepy stuff (even if Team Evil got stupid. Seriously, the fake Moody could have just handed Harry a book to zap him right to Voldemort, rather than waiting months...)

By the fifth book...well, it's gotten pretty gnarly. The people in power are turning nasty, and it does make a case that doing the right thing isn't always easy. Or popular.

Thinking about it, I suppose I have a soft spot for the series, despite intellectually acknowledging its many flaws.
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.

--The horror of Mario

Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
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Post by Crissa »

Maxus: The fake Moody was setting up a way to murder Harry legally.

But mostly, yeah. Also, it's written accessibly to the language of people today.

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Post by Maj »

I started reading The Omnivore's Dilemma, by Michael Pollan. Quite the read.
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Post by Cynic »

just finished the second part of "the book of the new sun." Sword & Citadel.

As usual Gene Wolfe blows my expectations out of the water but yet it took me a whole 6 weeks to read the 400 pages. it should have taken me two days.

it gets slower and more day-to-day in these books and that is what accords for that possibly.

this is a definite different sort of epic. also what does this qualify as? spacegun & sandal? space opera? what?
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Post by Orion »

Maxus wrote:Okay, I was thinking about the Harry Potter series today and wondering WHY it's so successful.

It's...easy to dismiss it as a kid's series, but it grew up along with its first readers. I mean, the first book presents the magical side of things as happy and funny and with a lot of stuff played for laughs.
Darker and edgier is not more grown up. The series' last installments are substantially less "mature" by any rubric I can conceive of than the earlier ones. Though a bigger issue than than the "immaturity" is the fact that

the series devolves from black and white all the way to a black and black morality in which even the nominal goodguys are soulcrushingly evil.
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Post by Maxus »

Orion wrote:
Maxus wrote:Okay, I was thinking about the Harry Potter series today and wondering WHY it's so successful.

It's...easy to dismiss it as a kid's series, but it grew up along with its first readers. I mean, the first book presents the magical side of things as happy and funny and with a lot of stuff played for laughs.
Darker and edgier is not more grown up. The series' last installments are substantially less "mature" by any rubric I can conceive of than the earlier ones. Though a bigger issue than than the "immaturity" is the fact that

the series devolves from black and white all the way to a black and black morality in which even the nominal goodguys are soulcrushingly evil.
I was mainly thinking about how freaking much it fucks up Harry's life in the 5th book, where he was saying something the Man didn't want him saying. Just...yeah.

The moral WTFs at the last two are definitely...yeah.
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.

--The horror of Mario

Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
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Post by RiotGearEpsilon »

what moral WTFs are these?
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Post by Maxus »

RiotGearEpsilon wrote:what moral WTFs are these?
The books establish that there's three curses which earn you an instant life-sentence if you get caught using them.

One flat-out kills people if its hits them, one basically sets off every sensation of pain it can all over their body, and the third controls someone's free will.

In book seven, Harry uses #2 and #3. Sure, for good causes --sort of. Mind Control was a temporary thing when Harry and Co. was breaking into somewhere and basically couldn't afford to let someone find them out. Fairly harmless, but...still, he used one of them. Second one was Harry being ripshit PISSED at one of his teachers being mistreated by some flunky on Team Evil, and instantly popped the guy which the second curse. His teacher said, "Honestly, Harry, it's very...noble, but..." with the idea being the thought was nice but Harry really needs to think a little more.
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.

--The horror of Mario

Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
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Post by Avoraciopoctules »

I bought another D&D novel today. I feel very mildly ashamed. In this case, it's an Eberron book about some kind of secret agent. I remember purchasing and reading the previous one in the series and finding it fairly entertaining.

Fortunately it was a mere side-effect of a trip to pick up book 2 of the Codex Alera series.

EDIT: finished post
Last edited by Avoraciopoctules on Thu Jan 21, 2010 1:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Neeeek »

Maxus wrote:
The books establish that there's three curses which earn you an instant life-sentence if you get caught using them.
Never really understood why they'd all have that sentence. Especially for Aurors, the Imperius Curse isn't just ethically permissible, it's the safest, most humane way to do their job. Prolonged use, sure. But taking over someone's body temporarily isn't really a major violation of their rights, if the end is justifiable.
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Post by Maxus »

Neeeek wrote:
Maxus wrote:
The books establish that there's three curses which earn you an instant life-sentence if you get caught using them.
Never really understood why they'd all have that sentence. Especially for Aurors, the Imperius Curse isn't just ethically permissible, it's the safest, most humane way to do their job. Prolonged use, sure. But taking over someone's body temporarily isn't really a major violation of their rights, if the end is justifiable.
They did say the Aurors have limited ability to use the curses, in tight situations. But the Imperius is...hell, it apparently has a long duration unless the target can fight it off, and the target *can* be made to act normally until they are needed to do otherwise. It'd be easy to abuse, so I can understand why they want it used as little as possible by the general population...

Besides, the whole 'raping the free will' thing...
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.

--The horror of Mario

Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
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Post by Cielingcat »

Actually that's kind of a ridiculously huge violation of their rights.

Like seriously, I can't really think of anything that's less of a violation of someone's rights.
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Post by Maxus »

Cielingcat wrote:Actually that's kind of a ridiculously huge violation of their rights.

Like seriously, I can't really think of anything that's less of a violation of someone's rights.
Yeah. Or, it's potentially the most violating thing.

But for what Harry did with it (basically get someone out of the way with no harm to themselves or others, if i remember right)...well, I can understand that.

But I still wouldn't trust anyone to do it to me. Not even Harry Potter.
He jumps like a damned dragoon, and charges into battle fighting rather insane monsters with little more than his bare hands and rather nasty spell effects conjured up solely through knowledge and the local plantlife. He unerringly knows where his goal lies, he breathes underwater and is untroubled by space travel, seems to have no limits to his actual endurance and favors killing his enemies by driving both boots square into their skull. His agility is unmatched, and his strength legendary, able to fling about a turtle shell big enough to contain a man with enough force to barrel down a near endless path of unfortunates.

--The horror of Mario

Zak S, Zak Smith, Dndwithpornstars, Zak Sabbath. He is a terrible person and a hack at writing and art. His cultural contributions are less than Justin Bieber's, and he's a shitmuffin. Go go gadget Googlebomb!
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